SFWMD Recreation Meeting 5/22

[N. Cook]

Thanks to all who came out....a really good crowd for UW-F and DELTA...and David even "admitted" he was from DU!!! Seriously, we had them surrounded!

The important part of the meeting was the presentation on why STA 2 will not open this year. Whatever your feelings, the District even brought the supervisors of the the contractors on the project to the meeting.....a real commitment on their part to show they wanted to make a strong case.

We asked for a road for access next year from Rt. 27 to prevent the long drive down from Rt. 880 in case STA 2 opens next year.

STA 1 W currently also is not in the recommendation going to the Board in June. I am trying to get the two back cells in the plan. Jerry has promised to present it to the STA folks this week and try to overcome the objections of the "scientists". We may get it in. Would be 25 permits.

STA 5 will remain as is.

STA 3/4 will have 50 permits on one day. No two day hunting. This will preserve the 3000 permits as per last year.

The boat ramps will be built in the Reserviors, but public access may be delayed up to two years as they are "tested".

Alligator hunting will proceed this year in STA 5 with 25 permits for 50 gators. Pemiting is on the FWC site.

The Shady Oak area boat ramp on Lake Kissimmee is planned but the Polk County people need to step up and commit to maintaining it.

The signing on the Kissimmee River may be changed to allow airboats to pole behind the line toward the bank. Current rules allowing "kickers" behind the line will remain. We suggested again that airboats be allowed behind the signs at "idle speed".

BJ reviewed a number of possible properties for Small Game Hunting Areas and at least two should be approved for this fall. The review of District lands not currently open for public access will continue.

The closure of access to the LOXAHATCHEE FEDERAL REFUGE south area (the area open to hunting and fishing) is expected to be about 30 days. Jerry has requested the contractor to plan the closing in February 2007 after duck season.

The boat ramp at Cornwall for the Kissimmee River will be open until the new ramp on the Istakpoga is ready. Accesss to the duck hunting in the marshes north of the ramps will not be interupted.

I will be glad to discuss in more detail if you have questions.

[novaalex]

That is pretty much what happened folks. The issue of STA2's closure needs to be looked at the following way. It is not an issue of how hard it is to get to the hunting area. The SFWMD understands that we will work as hard as necessary to get to a hunting area. The problem is the potential for conflict with the contractors. I for one can vouch for myself and my closest friends as far as us not creating any conflict but I will not say the same for all the hunters that go to the STA's. I have seen plenty of f'up shat in my days to know better. I may agree that there is no good reason for the closure, but I am not willing to hang everything in the balance so that some bonehead can mess up the future of my hunting. As far as the vacant land. Rocky Glades will be completely flooded and a 200 acre STA will be built south of it adjacent to the s332 pump station. If we can get an access road other than the park boundary chances are we will be able to hunt there. The District will also open a 200+ acre small game area off of Richmond Drive that will probably be managed for dove hunting. These properties are near and dear to my heart and thanks go to Fred, Jerry, and B.J. for addressing my concerns. I saw a lot of new faces at the meeting, I am sure that you will agree that it was an educational experience. Last but not least I want to thank all of you. Thanks to your communication the District heard you loud and clear about not hunting the STA's more than once a week. They addressed the issue of no net loss in permits by increasing the number at STA3/4 just on Saturdays, expect to see this increase in years to come as the suitability of the land is studied more. All in all a good meeting hopefully we can get those two back cells open in STA 1 and then we will have gained 1000 spots instead of just breaking even or losing spots.

[David B]

My Son & I enjoyed the meeting very much. You should know that he has never sit still that long in his life. The 2. 5 hour drive each way gave us plenty of time to talk. With our busy schedules, we usally don't see each other that often anymore.
I asked him his thoughts on the meeting and the people there. He started out with that he learned something from the process of the meeting and the way that everyone listened before they spoke their minds.
We tallied the numbers of user groups at the meeting on our way home. The waterfowlers almost out numbered the staff.
Dustin mentioned that even though he only had time to hunt twice last season with his school schedule and work, he was thankful for those opportunites . He commented that others will want to be able to do the same and standing up for them was the right thing to do. He further commented that people took time off of work, spent money on gas, to work towards something that they like to do. He mentioned dedication.

Gus & Gals,
I am scared. When did he grow up so fast?
He asked me to go along on his day off.

As for my take on the meeting. I am happy to have been apart of it. I feel that the district came clean on their reasons for limiting access to the STAs that Newton posted above.
I couldn't agree more with Alex's statement, to jeopardize the STAs because of an unpredictable incident from an idiot would be a grave mistake on our part.
Jerry Krenz was informed of our concern that keeping us out of an STA was not to our liking and that we (I) were/was worried about not getting back in at a later date.

If you ever want to attend a meeting that will affect your decisions about the district and show your support to your love of waterfowling, then I suggest that you make one of these in the future.

I want to apologize if I sounded harsh or offended anyone in some of my post before the meeting. It wasn't my intention at all.

My thanks to Newton, Alex, Jeff and all of the other folks who showed their support.

Respectfully
David

[N. Cook]

Thanks for coming down David....and thank you for all the work you do for UW-F in the Kissimmee area. You are the guy we go to for help and depend on for on the ground information on a very large and important duck hunting habitat controlled by the SFWMD. It was a pleasure meeting Dustin and perhaps we created another "volunteer" for the future!

We had a great crowd.....and I think some of the need to work with the District, even when you may disagree, was demonstrated. UW-F gets things done because we have convinced some of the key staff at the District that we will not be bomb throwers and run to either the newspapers or the lawyers every time we do not get what we want.....even when it is not "right or fair". Having people working for you in that vast bureaucacy instead of against you is important.

I was disapointed we did not get more parties on STA 5....but then the 50 pairs idea in lieu of two days of 25 on STA 3/4 was decided as a way we could overcome "inside" objections to raising the number of parties each hunt....There is a good logical reason to go to 50 this season to offset the loss of STA 1 W and the plan was oked by those "objectors".....and, if it works without a problem ( and I know it will), there will be a precedent set and the next year getting more pairs on STA 5(and other STAs) will be highly probable. (strategy, I might add, suggested by Jerry)

Little noted was the new rule allowing one "non hunter" with each party....can you guess what that strategy is leading to? The District is not the culprit on the current limit on number of people hunting....We need to show 3 is safe....what better way than the simple rule change proposed.

Progress happens because of quite, persistent and strategic work...

Lots of UW-F folks work that way all across Florida.

[labraduck]

Newton, I'm a little confused about the issuance of 50 Saturday permits at STA3/4. Had they kept the Saturday and Sunday hunts at STA3/4, I would have assumed that we would be able to put in for two permits, one on each day. This would have kept the same number (3) of permits per individual that was granted last year. Is there any provision to allow one hunter to put in for two permits at STA3/4 this year? I'm sorry if this issue was addressed before, but I didn't see it.

[N. Cook]

Sharp thinking! Yes, it was considered that it will reduce the actual ability to apply for hunts by ONE this year (that is why I am fighting so hard to get some hunting on the back cells of STA 1 W).....Compromise seemed to be the best way to placate those who objected to two day hunting on an STA and keep the same total number of hunting opportunities, PLUS break the 25 pair barrier....that last one is the really important one!

It is expected "walk on" opportunity will increase at STA 3/4......

Hunting on STA 1 W back cells is very iffy as of today, but it never hurts to ask.

[novaalex]

Labraduck you are correct in your thought that we may have cheated ourselves a little, but there was no provision and there is no historical precedent that the FWC of SFWMD would have allowed us to get two permits. I can only think of the havoc that would have caused on the permitting system. As far as raising the pairs that is the most crucial change to date. We have finally got them to agree that more than 25 pairs can be allowed per session, I hope that this signals a trend for the future. Last but no least if you would have been able to hunt STA 3/4 Sat and Sunday it would have doe you know good because everyone in their right mind would have front-loaded their permits it would have gotten burned out and by seasons end the birds would have been gone. As it stands righ now it will get hit hard on Saturday and have plenty of time to recover. Also STA5 is going to be great on Sundays.

[godvlman]

Newton,

I am a little confused myself.. I am sorry I did not make the meeting, however, I was out of town and would of loved to be there....

You are allowed to take one "non hunter" What is that?? Are you saying that they can apply for a permit without having a hunting license, and take up one of the 50 permits for the day and decline a waterfowler acess to hunt that day?? I can see all of the "PETA" people applying for a permit!!!

Or are you saying that I can take someone into the area and if they have a hunting license shoot there 6 ducks if that is going to be the limit this year and come out with 18 birds?? Call me a devils advocate.. but this does not make sense to me!!!

Can non hunters apply for permits and bring 2 hunters in with them or not??

In my eyes if you are going to let 3 people in the gate let them hunt!!! This does not make sense to me!!

I understand the idea of "setting presedence" but I dont think this one is going to work in our favor and I hope that I am wrong!!

I am all for bringing in youth hunters and introducing them into the sport but I dont think that is the reason for letting the 3rd person in the gate!!!

One more thing... If we are going to let 50 permits in the gate are they going to let us hunt the back cells that were closed last year like I asked before???

It is things like this that we think are going to work in our favor that end up being our worst nitemare...and Newton dont take this the wrong I appreciate everything you do.. I am just simply playing the devils advocate on this one and trying to fix a mistake before it happens!!!

[N. Cook]

The major purpose of the third person was to allow a non hunting child. However, the proposed regulations would not stipulate age. The third person has no permit to hunt and only the two permit holders can shoot...and their limit is two limits.

Some folks had asked for this.

Remember, all this discussion is about what Dr. Williams is putting in her PROPOSAL to the Board. Nothing written in stone yet....and there will probably be at least one more chance to comment before it goes to a vote.

[godvlman]

Newton,

Thanks for clarifying that for me .... It still doesnt make sense to me but I guess we will have to see what happens.... If they are going to give us acess for a 3rd person why not let it be a hunter??

But like you said maybe it is a foot in the door come next year!!!

[Ornithologist]

I am having trouble understanding the question of allowing non-hunters that are not counted in the daily limit. I run a check station. I am not about to tell some guy at 4:30 am that he cannot take his non-hunting wife, son, daughter, neice, cousin, etc. along for the boat ride. I do use the "observer" joke...

Do you have an observer permit?
No! They're $50. Cash only. Catch me on the way out...

Later...

[N. Cook]

There are "gatekeepers" who will "bend" the rules, but then there are others who will not....

Dupuis WMA....no rule bending there!

The STAs...the gatekeepers are nice folks....and when they "bend" the rules.....people complain. So the rules are probably going to be more "by the book" next season. Normally, a few complaints can be ignored...but as everyone should know by now, the STAs are different...hunting is under very strict scrutiny, often by people who would like to see it banned.

We try to get the regulations written in as broad a scope as possible to help the gatekeepers have a little flexibility.

[novaalex]

Can't we just leave it alone already!

[godvlman]

Alex.

I guess if you are not worried about it ... neither am I .. I still am going to call BS on the fact!!! And it will come back to haunt us!!!

I dont know what is going on behind closed doors but... we will see!!!!